Author Topic: Things to Do  (Read 687 times)

Weaver

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #15 on: August 01, 2017, 11:41:47 PM »
Alright, if you are so hellbent on derailing this thread, then here you go:


I assume you are talking about Greater Ryne's major defeat today. You have set travel from god knows where, to defend a useless settlement on the frontlines, and a vassal with so few troops, had you not come in to assist him, his army would've routed and fled, not a hair missing on his head- you'd have lost a bit over 50 troops, and some pride.


This should be sufficient enough to explain what went wrong and how it has nothing to do with activity, but I am sure you won't be satisfied with that, so I'll go into more detail.


Instead of letting the battle go and cutting your losses, you threw blob after blob after blob into the fray- in the end losing you 600 soldiers, and 3 First Ones. Your miscalculation of the battle-timer and the speed of your Nobles lost you that battle. Not activity. Had you dropped 60 or 50 soldiers, you would've actually made it on time to the battle. Again, nothing to do with activity. And even if you had done all this and joined the battle- I'd have killed 1000 troops, and 5 First Ones.


The very first mistake was even picking a fight with us, when all you had was a bunch of archers and medium infantry. In fact, when I realized this, I thought it was so laughable I only sent Ironsun and his vassal to deal with you- but it turned out you are a bit more coordinated and active than what you make yourself out to be. Every battle against Ironsun and his Vassal, had all the nearby Nobles involved in that battle. 'Inactivity' is not an excuse you can use. You were perfectly active in victory, but in defeat, suddenly activity is an issue?


Last but not least, you abandoned your fortifications to pick a fight with superior troops in quantity and quality. An error so grave, that even if I was away from the game for a whole week, you'd just suicide on my army. You should've run.


Finally, in regards to maneuvers: yes, that is the proper way to wage warfare. I had simple objectives, and I was going to execute them without a single distraction. My position would've been so great had I just done that, I wouldn't even have to fight you. But if you are going to suicide your forces on my forces, why should I decline that? You are giving me things for free, and I am very, very, grateful.

De-Legro

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2017, 12:00:03 AM »
Please don't be facetious. Assist action just gets you destroyed if your timing is not ideal and your enemy is more active and not dumb. War is all about opportunity and maneuvres. You need to be there to change your destination when the enemy moves. You need to be there to start travelling in time to get to the battle in time when it starts in the first place. You need to be there to start a timely retreat and not get caught by regrouping enemies if you failed the previous action. Come on, we all play this game and know how fighting plays out when you can't check on it constantly.
I don't know who's being fooled by this "few minutes a day" thing. It's like we're not playing the same game. smh

Sure, yet Hawks rely on Military Aid a lot. We have two battle raging against Gwent now, and 80% of our participants had to rely on military aid to join, hell I had to use it for two of my characters, and I am online 14 + hours a day due to work. I am sure we could be more efficent if I could rely on having people around to move 24 hours a day, but I can't. Nor do I wish to command more then 10 characters myself total, its not fun to do nor do I find it rewarding to win wars through nothing but my own effort.

What I will say is military aid is FAR more useful when you are the side with the initiative. Again I mention that I would love to change the game to be less reliant on our characters as glorified troops carriers. I would love to aid mechanics that allows for some sort of automation of military units based on a series of "commands", rules that you can give the NPC commander of that army. Ideally I would make it so that all military action occured in such a way, and reduce the ability to make rapid and instant military decisions. If all parties have to deal with a slower chain of command and none have absolute control of their forces, I would hope that fighting would move back towards whom has the better preparation and strategy rather then just who can move 3k of troops around the fastest.

Mount & Blade Warband had a follow party mechanic and it was incredibly useful. No idea how you'd implement it in M&F, but it's something that has been discussed in the past and is certainly worth raising again.

Yes there was a web game sort of similar to BM that had a similar mechanic. Basically most players sat around raising troops and then setting them to follow the few ultra active marshals. In my vision of the game without characters as essential troops leaders, such a mechanic would be relatively easy to add to the basic control interface, it ends up basically being a permission like any other.
It's nice it worked out that way for you, but to me it hardly seems like a normal case.

Orders can change, and realistically there's usually about a day of a grace period before things can go wrong if no one follows. But it could easily be less than that.

To me that is bad strategy. When Elysium was at its finest I could indeed change orders and now that at least that core of thirty something characters would follow the new strategy. If you don't have that level of activity, as Hawks in general no longer does, then I am afraid that the concept of changing orders goes out the window in most cases. You are simply better off following the game plan. The truth is that if you think things are going to go bad with the current orders, unless you know people are going to be able to respond things are probably going to go worse if you change orders. Plus people just get angry at you for doing it.

What if movement turns when back to only once every 6 hours? Not quite BM level but then you don't need to be checking things constantly and also you have "potentially" far greater time to respond to emerging battles and start marching.
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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #17 on: August 02, 2017, 12:02:25 AM »
The derailment of this topic from the outset is annoying. I ask for ideas on other things people would like to do in game, specifically asking those who want to play more than a few minutes a day, and the entire topic devolves into an argument about how you can't play in a few minutes a day or how everything is wrong with how you strategize.

So, let's try this again.

For those of you who would want to have more things to do in game, what are they?
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Weaver

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2017, 12:15:14 AM »
I want to see more Noble interactions. In general, simply things to do with First Ones, not necessarily dungeons or tournaments/duels. Even something as simple as a Dungeon sort of thing, localized on settlements, where Nobles can ICly and physically be- like placement on a map sort of thing, to aid RP interaction between First Ones. You could go a step further and furnish local lord Estates/Embassies/Palaces, and customize them, for these RP events. I know it's a bit too general, but that's the direction I'd go in.


Furthermore, I'd like 'brands' in the game. Like Ascalonian steel or Gwent cheese, as a way to raise gold for the aforementioned furnishing or whatever else you could do with gold.

Demivar

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2017, 12:34:01 AM »
Furthermore, I'd like 'brands' in the game. Like Ascalonian steel or Gwent cheese, as a way to raise gold for the aforementioned furnishing or whatever else you could do with gold.
Wrong way round. Ascalonian food & wine is the best food and wine, as stated by the finest food critics and sommeliers in all of Ascalon.
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De-Legro

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2017, 01:17:09 AM »
In my opinion the game needs NPC events that provide the setting for player interaction. Things like bandits that require people to co-operate to firstly secure a region against their attacks, and then scout out their hideout for example. The original design took sandbox to mean only player generated content. I don't think that is feasible for a web game that isn't supposed to dominate your life.
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silvershot

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2017, 01:43:22 AM »
In my opinion the game needs NPC events that provide the setting for player interaction. Things like bandits that require people to co-operate to firstly secure a region against their attacks, and then scout out their hideout for example. The original design took sandbox to mean only player generated content. I don't think that is feasible for a web game that isn't supposed to dominate your life.

Yes, I agree absolutely.

Gustav Kuriga

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2017, 11:56:26 PM »
[Moderator De-Legro actions. Cleaning up this reply. While several of us, including myself derailed this topic Andrew has requested it get back on track, so I am removing posts that might fan the off topic discussion again. Ideally, get your personal feuds off the forum.]

A dead horse to beat on? All self-deprecating jokes aside, perhaps a way to funnel new recruits to a specific settlement? It would have to be relatively short-ranged to avoid people sending troops from halfway across the map, but this would make it much, MUCH easier for players who don't have the time available to actively fight a war to still contribute to the strength of a realm. It would possibly also put more emphasis on regional power rather than full on centralization.

There would have to be something to keep besieged towns from receiving these troops magically (someone blocking travel at the settlement should also block said soldiers), and a delay between when the soldier is recruited, and when they show up in the settlement they were sent to, based on distance.
« Last Edit: August 03, 2017, 07:52:30 PM by Gustav Kuriga »

cenrae

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #23 on: August 03, 2017, 06:37:47 AM »
TO be able to generate NPC like events to help facilitate the Quest system. I see the quests like the bulletin boards in Witcher 3. Some monsters in the area that needs killing. A peasant needs saving. that sort of thing.
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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #24 on: August 04, 2017, 09:45:15 PM »
Being able to duel with other FO, either to death or till one of the participants is wounded.
Maybe make it somewhat like the dungeon system, using or learning moves (stabbing , slashing, kicking,  shield bashing etc.).

Hunting. A less dangerous version of dungeon explorations. Various animals depending on the biome with a small chance to stumble apon a truly dangerous beast.


cenrae

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2017, 01:00:54 AM »
Very much like the hunting idea.
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De-Legro

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2017, 03:35:03 AM »
Being able to duel with other FO, either to death or till one of the participants is wounded.
Maybe make it somewhat like the dungeon system, using or learning moves (stabbing , slashing, kicking,  shield bashing etc.).

Hunting. A less dangerous version of dungeon explorations. Various animals depending on the biome with a small chance to stumble apon a truly dangerous beast.


There is a way to duel, its just annoy to set up.


[Moderator De-Legro actions. Cleaning up this reply. While several of us, including myself derailed this topic Andrew has requested it get back on track, so I am removing posts that might fan the off topic discussion again. Ideally, get your personal feuds off the forum.]

A dead horse to beat on? All self-deprecating jokes aside, perhaps a way to funnel new recruits to a specific settlement? It would have to be relatively short-ranged to avoid people sending troops from halfway across the map, but this would make it much, MUCH easier for players who don't have the time available to actively fight a war to still contribute to the strength of a realm. It would possibly also put more emphasis on regional power rather than full on centralization.

There would have to be something to keep besieged towns from receiving these troops magically (someone blocking travel at the settlement should also block said soldiers), and a delay between when the soldier is recruited, and when they show up in the settlement they were sent to, based on distance.


Part of my plans with making military units an actual thing is the ability to set up recruitment to funnel to marshaling area's. It might not get off the ground though because the other devs aren't thrilled with removing the character element from troops interactions
« Last Edit: August 05, 2017, 03:36:45 AM by De-Legro »
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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #27 on: August 06, 2017, 04:08:18 PM »
I've warmed up to it, actually.
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De-Legro

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #28 on: August 07, 2017, 01:20:48 AM »
I've warmed up to it, actually.

Yay, I will write up a proposal then.
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Gustav Kuriga

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Re: Things to Do
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2017, 08:09:22 PM »
Part of my plans with making military units an actual thing is the ability to set up recruitment to funnel to marshaling area's. It might not get off the ground though because the other devs aren't thrilled with removing the character element from troops interactions

I like the sound of that. As I said, it should be relatively short-ranged, no more than 3-4 provinces (in my opinion, though the exact range would probably change based on in-game experience) to avoid both full centralization, and so that troops aren't being sent halfway across the map.