Author Topic: So tired of slippery 1st ones  (Read 1844 times)

nanakisan

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So tired of slippery 1st ones
« on: November 18, 2014, 02:36:19 AM »
I don't know about you guys. But having like 50 soldiers against 2 nobles and 6 light infantry. I really wish the concept of overwhelming forces was a thing. I can understand a 1st one can maybe kill 3-4 soldiers quite easily before being wounded. But when against that many forces even the semi-immortal beings as 1st ones get overwhelmed. Eventually leading to a outright capture.

I don't play the game that much anyone. But i will be damned if i leave two afk nobles in my region with 56 entourage eating the food.

However despite my anger i at least get a chuckle out of it.

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #1 on: November 18, 2014, 02:50:33 PM »
The soldiers and entourage will go away after a while when they ZZZ.  Then you just end up with a no issue noble in the place.

However I do agree that small battles still need some tuning.  At the same time... what the game is not telling us is how we are attacking a single noble.  Think about that for a min.  One person we are going after... they are not going to line up in the field and march towards our marching army.  Instead they are going to try and fight a battle in the streets or forest...or where ever they can find cover and use the ground as part of the tactics.

Think of every movie you have seen where the 'hero' is fighting against the odds.  They run, hide, sneak up on a soldier, then put them down and hide again.  So you have 50 soldiers searching a town or land for this noble and his two warriors... much more simple to use those tactics with 3 against 50 and still slip away.

Point being, using our imagination a bit we can look at things from another view...instead of a game view that would force the two opposing armies into traditional battle.

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #2 on: November 18, 2014, 04:32:28 PM »
You left out the part where the guy/girl those 50 are hunting has the stats of a level 99 RPG character decked out in the rarest gear you can get and they're all at about level 10-ish. They're only hope is sheer numbers, or maybe that they're super experienced (which is rare). Sure, they're lead by a similar character, but all the enemy has to do is avoid getting engaged by that one, the rest are easy pickings or easy enough to avoid.
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Tom

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2014, 12:43:31 AM »
There's a tricky balance to be struck in small battles. On the one hand you don't want them to be too slippery, on the other you don't want to frustrate people by making being captured too easy.

Tan dSerrai

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2014, 11:23:21 AM »
Since the question of slippery nobles is mostly centered on unmoving, likely inactive chars:

How about adding some kind of timer counting 'was attacked and vastly outnumbered (1:40?) within estate x'...and once that timer is above 3, the capture probability is raised 5- or 10-fold.

Moving into a different estate would reset the timer.

This way only stationary, vastly outnumbered and repeatedly attacked nobles would be easier to capture.

De-Legro

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #5 on: November 19, 2014, 12:42:33 PM »
Since the question of slippery nobles is mostly centered on unmoving, likely inactive chars:

How about adding some kind of timer counting 'was attacked and vastly outnumbered (1:40?) within estate x'...and once that timer is above 3, the capture probability is raised 5- or 10-fold.

Moving into a different estate would reset the timer.

This way only stationary, vastly outnumbered and repeatedly attacked nobles would be easier to capture.


But it is trivial to tie down a character with multiple attacks, inactive or not. So it is still open to abuse.
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Tan dSerrai

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2014, 01:32:07 PM »
Yep, thats a concern. Still, Tom did state that a character _should_ be able to set movement while locked in battle....then, once the battle is finished, he should move _at once_ (=not wait until the movement tick). Basically a defeated character should have a very good to perfect chance to move away before being locked into a follow-up battle.

I assume this does currently not work (not sure though)...but (if or) once it does, that should take care of possible abuse.



Roran Hawkins

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2014, 01:35:19 PM »
Or sleeping characters becoming more vulnerable to being outnumbered? Incapable of personally fighting themselves and therefor bound to let only their retinue/troops fight?
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Valast

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2014, 05:00:30 PM »
If they are inactive then it is a non issue.  The troops will go away.  No need to worry about it.  Just accept that you will feed them for a short time and then they will disband and join your population.  We went down this road a long time ago and this was the solution.

If it is an active noble... that is when it becomes an issue.  If they are just hanging out doing nothing...

One thing I have been thinking of would be a summons option with a timer.  Noble of an estate can issue as summons (using entourage of some type) to any noble within spotting distance.

The summoned noble would then be able to choose accept or decline.  If accepted (or the timer runs out) then the summoned noble is escorted to the presence of the Nobles estate.

Once there, the landed noble can choose to capture the summoned noble (thus being able to take him/her outside the city walls or elsewhere) Or do other sorts of tasks that require two nobles to be within interaction distance.  For example: Oaths or troops/entourage assignments.

The interaction range thing has been an issue for a while.  Where two nobles who are in the same town, are just slightly out of interaction range...they have to travel just enough to change that.

--

IF they decline the summons then it is a direct indication that this player IS IN play.  They are doing what ever it is they are doing for a reason...like it or not, annoying or not, it is their game play.  So you go to battle to remove them.


De-Legro

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Re: So tired of slippery 1st ones
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2014, 09:41:27 PM »
Yep, thats a concern. Still, Tom did state that a character _should_ be able to set movement while locked in battle....then, once the battle is finished, he should move _at once_ (=not wait until the movement tick). Basically a defeated character should have a very good to perfect chance to move away before being locked into a follow-up battle.

I assume this does currently not work (not sure though)...but (if or) once it does, that should take care of possible abuse.


That in no way fixes everything. Sure in a 1 v 1 scenario you can get away. Now face 3 v 1, with the three staggering the start of individual battles in order to ensure there is no time that you are not in a battle.
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