Author Topic: The Kingdom of Ascalon  (Read 21021 times)

Calpurnius

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2014, 01:20:24 PM »

EDIT 2: Just my personal opinion, but spawning characters inside settlements and being granted the entire militia is a bit of a poor way of fighting an open war with us. At least march your lords towards me. Maybe this is irrelevant bitching because you have three times the soldiers I have at the moment and growing, but you could at least give me the time to defend myself by marching here instead of teleporting. Or even more fun, teleporting here and marching at the same time.

That may answer a part of the question why grant control. If they are under Gorling or Squilace control, then they are spawned in their own settlements.
How many settlements have they taken ? What are they demanding ? What have you offered to end the war ?

Roran Hawkins

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2014, 01:22:57 PM »
They are steadily taking settlements, focussing on those who bring the most resources. They haven't even attempted to communicate with me yet, and I have been attacked every time I came near. Hence, I haven't been able to communicate with them either without risking losing manpower.


EDIT: Oh well, I attempted to contact them. Here goes nothing.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2014, 01:56:23 PM by Roran Hawkins »
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De-Legro

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2014, 01:59:24 PM »
That may answer a part of the question why grant control. If they are under Gorling or Squilace control, then they are spawned in their own settlements.
How many settlements have they taken ? What are they demanding ? What have you offered to end the war ?

You don't need to control a settlement to spawn in it though.
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Roran Hawkins

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2014, 02:03:38 PM »
You don't need to control a settlement to spawn in it though.


He is right in a way though, but I still consider 'House Squillace' territory as Ascalonian territory. Hence, there are Gorling lords spawning inside Ascalon, and attacking me in the rear with local militias.
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De-Legro

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #34 on: June 17, 2014, 02:25:41 PM »

He is right in a way though, but I still consider 'House Squillace' territory as Ascalonian territory. Hence, there are Gorling lords spawning inside Ascalon, and attacking me in the rear with local militias.

How do they get the milita? I was not aware those permissions worked yet. Regardless spawning characters in a war zone has always been a cheap tactic.
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Roran Hawkins

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #35 on: June 17, 2014, 02:31:47 PM »
I am not entirely sure, since when I scouted the settlement he most likely came from there was noone there. He doesn't own the settlement though, so I suppose the owner arrived after I left and gave him the militia, ready to travel to the next settlement and give all the militia there to another freshly spawned chara I suppose. That's just my theory.


In any case, if we can add two new enemy lords that just showed up to the enemy's numbers they have about 3.5 times as many troops at least, to even 4 times as many soldiers if they actually do what I just suggested in the previous alinea.



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Tom

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #36 on: June 17, 2014, 03:06:25 PM »
From what you tell it sounds like yet another cheap war, borderline cheating, to win, win, win.

I'd like to hear the other side. If all you say is true, you might want to reach out to your neighbours and tell them that beating down such dishonourable scum is in everyones interest.

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #37 on: June 17, 2014, 03:31:49 PM »
I'm only speculating here, and I want to make clear that I'm only telling here what I seem to notice and experience, but this is getting strange. They just changed names again to 'Tospan independant', which is just ... strange. House Tospan was a small house that were vassals of House Mali, who originally rebelled. I have the idea that a lot in their side of the conflict is being OOC'ly decided, since no way that the Duchess who'd rather rebel than step down would voluntarily grant leadership to a vassal of her ex-liege, nevermind one of her own vassals. I have no idea what the actual fuck they intend to do now.
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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #38 on: June 17, 2014, 06:14:37 PM »
As I said: Reach out of your neighbours.

Stonedman

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #39 on: June 17, 2014, 08:02:34 PM »
Defeat the lands within our own borders, amass our forces and push them back.
We have 80+ lands against their 20, figure it out, we shouldn't "need" help.


If they are taking empty settlements, then it's our own stupid fault for leaving them empty.
Change the settings so new characters cannot spawn in the settlements = problem solved (that is a game option under manage permissions)

Roran Hawkins

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #40 on: June 17, 2014, 09:35:06 PM »
I'm the first one to admit that we didn't have enough troops to begin with, but we never really had an idea of howmany we should have. Essentially, 90% of the realm consists of players whose first realm is Ascalon, and as a result players who never fought a war or needed troops for anything else than having troops.
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Calpurnius

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #41 on: June 17, 2014, 11:37:03 PM »
I'm finding this whole thing confusing.

First you say it your whole realm against one rebel, and ask no one to get involved. At first that sounds like a sure way to beat someone from the game.
They get some help and you suggest at least 4 different realms are going to stomp you out of game.
Then you mention that the person who helped was their vassal, and given them some land.  ??? were you trying to take that land from them ???
I think that would upset me enough to ask the person who had helped me before.
You say they are taking all your lands, I can't see much change on map.
If you have been approaching their settlements and asking to talk, why does it sounds like this is your first attempt.
You started a war against the rebel, are you saying you have never attacked or taken control of any of their regions.
I would very much like to hear what really prompted someone to break away and seek help from someone so far away.
I've read in this thread someone mentioning how poorly you were treating them, and advised you against it.

I also wish they would come to forum and tell their side.




Roran Hawkins

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #42 on: June 17, 2014, 11:59:18 PM »
I'm finding this whole thing confusing.

First you say it your whole realm against one rebel, and ask no one to get involved. At first that sounds like a sure way to beat someone from the game.


Yes, because they revealed they had been receiving reinforcements from their old realm for some time now. Additionally, my wargoal was to force her to step down as a Duchess and give her lands to her family. As a player, she'd lose next to nothing, but her character'd lose pretty much. I don't see how this is beating someone from the game.

They get some help and you suggest at least 4 different realms are going to stomp you out of game.


At that time we saw characters from at least 4 other realms near their capital. I did not have the time to meticulously check what they were doing exactly, because they chased me away. I recognised this situation, them calling for aid to several Rathgari clans, as yet another possible case of 'Rathgar clans accidentally slaughters a realm because they overestimate the defences'. I don't think that my reaction is abnormal here.
Then you mention that the person who helped was their vassal, and given them some land.  ??? were you trying to take that land from them ???


Duchess Erin was RP'ed as if she was moonsick/mad/insane, and she had caused diplomatic incidents with two other realms already. We intended to remove her from her position as Duchess and reduce her holdings to one town, the rest being spread along her family members, one being given to the new Duke. The player misunderstood my message as her entire House being reduced to a single region somehow, and called for aid and rebelled. As a result House Gorling came to their aid, but for some reason an unaffiliated member from House Squillace, a House Gorling vassal, was given leadership over the rebelling Duchy for no apparent reason except OOC ones as far as I know. IC this can only be seen as a badly disguised attempt at annexation. Now recently the leader of the House and its named changed again to House Tospan, who were originally House Mali's vassals. Why they now lead the Duchy is once again completely unclear to me, and once again OOC/gamed reasons I suspect.

The gist of it:
  • I want her to step down and cede her lands to her family, and one region to the new Duke (for which her house could have received a region in exchange, should they have asked so)
  • She rebelled because she misunderstood that we wanted to take all her lands except one.[/size]
  • She called for help from her old liege lord because she believed we wanted to take all her regions.[/size]
  • Everything escalated.]

Does this explain everything in more detail to you?

I think that would upset me enough to ask the person who had helped me before.
You say they are taking all your lands, I can't see much change on map.


I never said they were taking all my lands, I said they were starting to advance, taking over my most strategical regions, those which are providing vital food and metal to my town. I am currently running on about -50 food deficit non-stop with all building halted, the other food producing regions being fought over right now.


If you have been approaching their settlements and asking to talk, why does it sounds like this is your first attempt.


I literally said it was my first attempt at contacting them. The other occasions were scouting, but they left the settlement to chase me away, and I assumed getting close to them was a bad idea for my scouts who had next to no troops. Hence, I did not contact them. I had some contact with lady Erin, but she suddenly gave all responsabilities to House Gorling and refused further contact, adding to the strange handing over of power when she rebelled to keep it just moments ago.

You started a war against the rebel, are you saying you have never attacked or taken control of any of their regions.
I would very much like to hear what really prompted someone to break away and seek help from someone so far away.
I've read in this thread someone mentioning how poorly you were treating them, and advised you against it.


I declared war against a rebel because usually when one of your lords renounces his oath and leaves your realm with a good portion of land you want the land back under your realm. The only reason I take regions from her is to press for peace negotiations in my favour.
About treating poorly, as I explained above. They weren't necessarily treated poorly, but perhaps the entire diplomatic incidents part was a bit unclear to some players. Saying she was being poorly treated or not is a matter of personal opinion. Point remained that everything we were talking about was based on conversations that had been spread over at least a dozen of characters and impossible to completely and accurately compile.


I also wish they would come to forum and tell their side.


I invite them to do so in fact. I'm only telling my story, how I experience things, how their actions look like from my side, but I do know that they might interpret that differently.
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Calpurnius

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #43 on: June 18, 2014, 12:52:09 AM »
It does sound like a misunderstanding. Should be easy to resolve through communications.

Roran Hawkins

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Re: The Kingdom of Ascalon
« Reply #44 on: June 18, 2014, 12:59:14 AM »
It is, but we have created an interesting situation now IC, and I don't want to just 'solve' this civil war through OOC measures. On the other hand, I don't want my realm to get crippled because of my fanboy-ism towards IC interaction either, so I'm now trying to achieve the goal of OOC discussion through IC diplomacy. That way they'll have a chance to influence how everything goes.





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