Author Topic: supply limits  (Read 9131 times)

Cynic

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #30 on: March 04, 2014, 10:54:01 AM »
The stockpile is not really a stockpile, it's a capacity your blacksmith has to make stuff.  It could make 5 axes or 3 spears, and making the 3 spears filled its capacity and can make nothing else for the moment.


I think there's a comment earlier in this thread saying that it's basically you don't choose what the blacksmith stockpiles beforehand and use it once it's made, you decide what it made when you come to do the training.

De-Legro

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #31 on: March 04, 2014, 10:59:34 AM »
5 axe + 3 spears: only possible to train 3 spears.

My char Harrak #158 controls settlement Saffagen 2806. He does not control any other settlements. He and his settlement are both members of Rathgar and of no other realms. He is a vassal of Zakath Eirikson, and so not a part of my main family.

Now: On the 'manage militia' page Saffagen had listed 3 spears and 5 axes as availiable. I did start retraining 3 'improvised' militia in spears - then wanted to retrain another in axe. However, after starting the 3 spears, my availiable equipment was listed as '0 spears (understandable) and 0 axe (not understandable).

Question: Is this wai? If yes this means that using equipment A does use up equipment B as well. This would be quite counter intuitive - if I have stockpiles listed I'd _vastly_ prefer to know how many of each type I can use.


It is meant to offer some flexibility. The number listed is the maximum available of each item, if nothing else changes. This allows you to put your "stockpile" into what ever items suits your needs. After each training though it recalculates. As I understand it melee weapons are pooled, ranged weapons are pooled and armour is pooled, though this is just based of a few observations so there may be more/fewer groups.
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Tan dSerrai

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #32 on: March 04, 2014, 11:26:52 AM »
Thanks for the help - that made it understandable!

It would maybe be worthwhile (once time allows...) to present this in a way that is a bit easier understandable.

Looking at the stockpiles in my main town it looks as if these items share a stockpile:

scale, chainmail (and presumably plate)
sword, broadsword
axe, spear, pike
shortsword, javelin and (I assume) shield
shortbow, crossbow (and presumably longbow)


It is not building specific - as a weaponsmith produces swords, broadswords, javelins and pikes but availiable numbers differ wildly for swords/Boradswords and javelins/pikes....so I assume its type specific.

A possible display could be:

Note: I think we could do away with the 'equipment available for resupply' and 'equipment available for retraining'...as the euqipment is NOT availiable but must be 'produced' or 'finished' out of preprepared stock first. The information about what trooptypes may be trained or resupplied could be moved to the training page, though that is not really necessary....the training page is very much self explanatory.
-------------------------

Current stockpiles allow the following equipment to be 'finished':

Axes or spears or pikes: x
shortbows or crossbows: y (with for example longbows inserted here once the archery school has been built)
Scale or chainmail: z

and so on....





Bubba

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #33 on: March 04, 2014, 11:31:29 AM »
The stockpile groupings are based on the buildings that produce them. Axes, spears and pikes all come from blacksmith. They're grouped.

Oh, and my problem earlier was not realising that blacksmiths needed wood. Now it is 100%.


Shield is carpenter, btw.

De-Legro

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #34 on: March 04, 2014, 11:38:15 AM »
Thanks for the help - that made it understandable!

It would maybe be worthwhile (once time allows...) to present this in a way that is a bit easier understandable.

Looking at the stockpiles in my main town it looks as if these items share a stockpile:

scale, chainmail (and presumably plate)
sword, broadsword
axe, spear, pike
shortsword, javelin and (I assume) shield
shortbow, crossbow (and presumably longbow)


It is not building specific - as a weaponsmith produces swords, broadswords, javelins and pikes but availiable numbers differ wildly for swords/Boradswords and javelins/pikes....so I assume its type specific.

A possible display could be:

Note: I think we could do away with the 'equipment available for resupply' and 'equipment available for retraining'...as the euqipment is NOT availiable but must be 'produced' or 'finished' out of preprepared stock first. The information about what trooptypes may be trained or resupplied could be moved to the training page, though that is not really necessary....the training page is very much self explanatory.
-------------------------

Current stockpiles allow the following equipment to be 'finished':

Axes or spears or pikes: x
shortbows or crossbows: y (with for example longbows inserted here once the archery school has been built)
Scale or chainmail: z

and so on....


The problem there is that different items in a group currently have different production level or different resource requirements depending on how you visualise it.  I agree though that if linked goods were displayed on a single line, that could make it somewhat clearer.


Axes (x), Spears (y), Piles (z)


If there was some linked value to display that might add in display as well


Axes (x), Spears (y), Piles (z) - Total magic number available

The stockpile groupings are based on the buildings that produce them. Axes, spears and pikes all come from blacksmith. They're grouped.

Oh, and my problem earlier was not realising that blacksmiths needed wood. Now it is 100%.


Shield is carpenter, btw.


Yes it would be nice if hovering over the efficiency rate showed what was limiting it.
He who was once known as Blackfyre

Tan dSerrai

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #35 on: March 04, 2014, 12:02:44 PM »
Aye, yes, this display would be better:
Axes (x) or Spears (y) or Pikes (z)

And supply is not only dependend on buildings - there seems to be a subdivision by type within a building as well:

In one settlement I have the following, all weaponsmith dependent items:

sword 14, broadsword 11 (seem linked) and javelin 100, shortsword 140. So I doubt that javelin and shortswords are directly linked to sword, broadsword.

De-Legro

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #36 on: March 04, 2014, 12:06:23 PM »
Aye, yes, this display would be better:
Axes (x) or Spears (y) or Pikes (z)

And supply is not only dependend on buildings - there seems to be a subdivision by type within a building as well:

In one settlement I have the following, all weaponsmith dependent items:

sword 14, broadsword 11 (seem linked) and javelin 100, shortsword 140. So I doubt that javelin and shortswords are directly linked to sword, broadsword.


Why? If they require less comparative resources why should they not have different values?
He who was once known as Blackfyre

Tan dSerrai

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #37 on: March 04, 2014, 12:34:02 PM »
You are correct that they _could_ be linked. I simply stated that I doubt it. I'll test it once a new training slot opens.

Tom

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #38 on: March 04, 2014, 12:42:16 PM »
5 axe + 3 spears: only possible to train 3 spears.

Yes, this is working as intended, which is why I originally didn't show stockpile values. Because they are actually abstracted. You don't really have 5 axes stored, you have work-hours from the blacksmith stored.

I know it's counter-intuitive. I just can't think of a much better way to display it at the moment.

Tom

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #39 on: March 04, 2014, 12:44:54 PM »
And supply is not only dependend on buildings - there seems to be a subdivision by type within a building as well:

No, there isn't. They depend on building and nothing else. See my other comment.

Tan dSerrai

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #40 on: March 04, 2014, 01:10:55 PM »
Thanks for that info - that helps a ton!

Knowing this now, a good display would be:

Your blacksmith has capacity to finish (x) axes or (y) pikes or (z) spears
Your carpenter has capacity to finish (x) shields
Your weaponsmith has capacity to finish (x) swords or (y) broadswords or (z) javelins or (a) shortswords

and so on.


Alternatively:

Your craftsmen have the capacity to finish the following equipment:

(x) axes or (y) pikes or (z) spears
(x) shields
(x) swords or (y) broadswords or (z) javelins or (a) shortswords

As long as the 'linked' types are somehow grouped and it is apparent that its not a 'of each' but a 'sum total of' in each group it should be easily understandable.

Tom

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #41 on: March 04, 2014, 03:29:57 PM »
Yes, but it makes the whole list less easy to read, unfortunately.

Calpurnius

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #42 on: March 04, 2014, 04:23:43 PM »
I had completed my very first Training Ground and Black Smith,  and thought I was allowed one of each item.

I believe inserting the word "or" will make it less confusing at first read.  Having linked items on it's own line of text, should help to understand relationship to manufacturer.



« Last Edit: March 04, 2014, 05:16:40 PM by Calpurnius »

Tom

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #43 on: March 04, 2014, 05:13:27 PM »
I had completed my very first T.G and B.S.,

what? can we not use chat abbreviations in a medieval atmosphere game, please? :-)

Mookzen

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Re: supply limits
« Reply #44 on: March 08, 2014, 02:40:20 PM »
The supply of equipment does replenish awfully slow even in a decent sized settlement with 100% productivity and a surplus of everything. I feel as though the relationship between the number of troops trainable without penalty and the amount of equipment that size of a settlement can produce is a bit out of sync. If a town can train 40 soldiers without penalty, then it should be able to supply at least that amount of troops with passable equipment. Once production gets going with multiple weaponsmiths making swords should be not much slower, if at all, than training people to use them properly. It does not take a weaponsmith a month to produce 1 sword unless he's like secretly a rebel or something. Either the troop training times are too fast (which they are not) or the supply is too slow (which it likely is considering larger settlements, let alone cities). It terms of gameplay balance I understand limiting advanced troops, but resorting to training troops wearing cloth for like 2 training cycles in a settlement that should pump out quality troops is a bit too much I feel, or is it just the twisted feelings I get when comparing to the liberal alpha experience. This might be the case where realist should give way to gameplay balance, but even then I feel the supply is on the slow side.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2014, 02:55:35 PM by Mookzen »