Author Topic: Following through on promises  (Read 7002 times)

Andrew

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2014, 02:40:35 AM »
I have 10 settlements right now. One is a region that I'm going to give to someone who was late to the GS, and I'm getting ready to hand another settlement over as well. It's likely that I will give a couple more of my settlements away when new players begin joining. The only difference is that they will get a settlement that has a few minor improvements, as compared to a settlement with nothing.


18 people have not shown up for the GS, which immediately leaves a bunch of space to fill in the middle of the realm. This is going to mean that some players are going to have more settlements than was originally intended.

I showed up late to the party, I'll admit. And I remember an email saying that there were only "a few" unused codes left. I used mine just today so that's down to "less than a few" hopefully.

At most, I'll probably take a few settlements for myself, just to set myself up for whatever silliness this game starts out with. As for the rest, not sure. I despise having more than three or four characters. Anything past that just gets cumbersome for me.

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Tom

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2014, 08:33:05 AM »
I don't see why anyone would want to have 10 regions at once. Too much

Bingo.

The High King of The Fading Isles (my character) holds one estate, and I intend to keep it that way. Soon, I will have more important things to worry about than construction queues.

Alumaani

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2014, 08:59:39 AM »
Hi Guys,

Im one of those players that 'land grabbed' at the start of the guided start but in truth, i thought everyone was allowed to do it!  I didnt realise that we were restricted to the areas laid out initialy, I simply thought they needed to be taken first.  I saw neighbours expanding outside of their initial regions and I thought BINGO, lets rock and roll.  I started in a strip of land 4 regions down and 3 regions across with wood on one side, grassland in the middle and mountains on the right and it made sense to simply take this area for a balanced resource set.  I did just that but someone flagged it up in my realm and pointed out it was frowned upon and I stopped.  I am now in the process of giving regions to my neighbours as they have characters offering me oath so it should even up quickly and I am now focused on simply building those regions.  I RP and I am building a story of my people that will stretch through history and interacting with fellow realm members to make the game it has the potential to be.

What are the rest of you doing?  I have no idea and I don't really care as my game does not involve a panicked bean counting scenario or the concern that my fellow players will have an 'advantage' because they own 2 more regions than me.  Let them have the advantage!  I'll enjoy working my way through it and progressing my family to power in other ways.  I will ENJOY leading armies and recounting the tales even if they are tales of defeat as they ENRICH the game as a whole and I will not worry that I am behind in some imaginary leaderboard that can NEVER exist in a game of this magnitude.

My advice?  Stop worrying about 'winning' and start simply 'being'.  Immerse yourself in the gameworld that has been created for you and the local area you exist in, enjoy gifting the areas you do take with names and a starting story and stop worrying about the lands of others.  You cannot fly and have no magic seeing device so get into character and work from the grass roots because do you know which part im looking forward to?  Let me tell you, i'm looking forward to hammering a small homeland out of the ragged northlands and creating a dynasty and kingdom for my people.  I dont care about the lands to the south but will relish the grandness of what we achieve in the north and the advances we have made until the day the southerners arrive with their shining mail and advanced armies and I will realise then that we actually have achieved little and probably now need to fight for our entire existence.  That's excitement and gameplay to me!  Not winning but striving against difficult odds and adding to the beauty and enjoyment of the game for everyone else.

Focus on that and not region counting and I bet you have a much greater experience over the coming weeks.

Foxglove

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2014, 03:38:40 PM »
Although I agree with all of the above posting, holding multiple settlements isn't always about gaining an advantage or edge. For people who are attracted to the world building, construction, aspect of the game, managing and improving settlements is where the main interest and enjoyment of the game is to be found.

I don't see why anyone would want to have 10 regions at once. Too much to keep track of

It really isn't. Back in the last Alpha Test, I held more than 10 settlements and only spent about 10 minutes per real life day managing them. It's all about good organization.
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Zakath

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2014, 04:31:02 PM »
I don't deny that you could run around with 10 characters, and then manage the build queues for the villages in 10 minutes. Especially considering that several villages will have only a few buildings, mostly saving their workers for production of resources. But why? The game isn't about painting the map in your colour, so to speak, it's about the interactions between players.


Another issue is keeping track of everything that happens. You can certainly write it down, or if you stay logged on for hours on end you'll simply know it, but why? Delegation makes realms manageable, micromanaging 10 villages, your armies, your defenses and diplomacy means you have to live in the game.


Each to his own I guess. I'll be perfectly happy holding a few regions, then delegate the rest. Allows me to spend my time actually having fun :)

Calpurnius

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #20 on: February 19, 2014, 05:23:28 PM »


800 territories available, between ~50 players in guided start, is 16 each.  Which means if people are anywhere above about 8 then there will be very little left over for anyone other than the guided start land-grabbers.  And that can't be good for the game, to have so much concentrated in the hands of the priveliged few.  I know when I see a game in a position like that it's a real disincentive to join.  It's like why bother, someone has already monopolised power and influence in the game.  I know that's not a true reflection, but it's the impression that matters not the truth.

Besides, the guided start people have ANOTHER opportunity to grab more land once guided start ends, and ALSO have a head-start with troops, positioning and planning.



I believe this is the point trying to be made.
All the comments I have read, are about how it affects their game play.

When game starts in March, there will be new players, you will need to give them some hope.
Those familiar with BM, will be more accepting that a privileged few own everything.

If you wish to grow the player base, people not familiar with this concept will need time to adapt. 
Must have enough hope to continue playing.

50 people owing 650 of 820 settlements at day one, doesn't offered a lot to a beginner.

Valast

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #21 on: February 19, 2014, 07:03:36 PM »
50 people owing 650 of 820 settlements at day one, doesn't offered a lot to a beginner.

I believe this and most of the arguments on this topic are flawed.  The Alpha test has IMO skewed our perspectives away from the true nature of the game.  At some point players will not be granted lands...they will be given armies and asked to follow the lord or ruler.  That is when even a knight can change the world.

I challenge everyone to go and read the game manual again.  Notably this part where it details out the level of knight...I mean the game is not called Might.  It is called Might AND fealty. http://mightandfealty.com/en/manual/knight


Calpurnius

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #22 on: February 19, 2014, 07:53:36 PM »
You are exactly right, at some point you will start out as a Knight.   In fact everyone starts out as a Knight. ( Except the first 50 )
The Guided Start allowed 50 people to start out as Rulers with free regions, accelerated build up, and a three week head start.

In March you want to start a new game and hopefully add to the player base.
Starting on day one as a Knight , with a very limited number of regions to conquer in the name of your Lord, will limit their role and interest.

If you want to change the thought pattern of a F2P-P2W person, you will need to give them time to adjust.
You will need to offer a vision of things to come, rather a career of servitude to a Lord.

Being familiar with BM, I can accept that. Not everyone who starts March will enjoy the concept. 
All they will see is:
                              new game, day one
                              too many powerful people
                              nothing available
                              too many obstacles to overcome

It's not my vision, so I really can't comment too much on how it is supposed to be.

Perhaps it is meant to be that the backers are to be the most powerful and have everything at the start. And that everyone after that just fits in where they can.   I'm sure everyone did that in BM, wasn't a problem for me, I accepted the fact I started a game that had been running for years.
This is a new game trying to gain interest and acceptance, have to offer something to entice them to start.
The only point attempting to being made, was not to have 50 people controlling everything, and not offering the possibility of gaining your own piece of the new continent.
The first 50 will have a clear advantage, just suggesting that it not be a total advantage, that limits any hope for a first time player at day one.

The comment was about  turning the Guided Start into a land grab, with land being a limited supply, those with more are more powerful.

Tom

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2014, 08:22:36 PM »
I expect you guys to help the new players into the game, that's part of the deal. Give them land, or give them troops to conquer something for themselves. Or give them guidance and things to do.

Tan dSerrai

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #24 on: February 19, 2014, 08:41:01 PM »
The whole point of the guided start is _not_ to supply a few top players with land - the point is to establish some culture and reference points to build upon. Yes, some land has been distributed - but there are vast open stretches in which new players can establish completely new realms, there are a lot of regions bordering the existing realms in which new players can found their own clans/duchies within the existing realms - and there is interest with near every early start player to aquire vassals and to give them land (at least as far as I get the feeling).

So there is a _lot_ to do for players entering the world fresh....much, much more than being a simple knight.

Calpurnius

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #25 on: February 19, 2014, 09:10:56 PM »
I agree with everything you just stated.

I very much hope it turns out the way you described.

My interpretation of the original post, was to make sure the current trend of conquered regions did not continue to the extreme,  which would have eliminated the " vast open stretches "

Bubba

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #26 on: February 19, 2014, 10:32:38 PM »

I agree with Alumaani's post, and I'll point out that Alumaani and LGMAlpha have contributed to the atmosphere of the game by creative narratives. These aren't bots mechanically driving toward dominance. Some of the best players are being singled out and demanded to defend themselves, and that is shameful. Play your own playstyles and quit worrying about others.

50 people owing 650 of 820 settlements at day one, doesn't offered a lot to a beginner.


Cynic's math was horrendously bad, since the average is more like 6 lands in Rathgar. He tailored his "data" to make the point that he wanted to make for other reasons.

But let's say everyone did have 16... even though not a single person has yet. Even if everyone wanted fifty lands, so what? Land can be opened up whenever needed. More continents can be made. Some will thrive, and some will burn out. There's a breaking point for those that overextend. There will always be vacuums to insert yourself into.

There's no reason to impinge on other people's playstyles over a few extra lands. You start this business with devs coming in and nannying whether you have too many lands, and it never stops. It can't stop at the end of guided start, because the stated reasons don't stop there. It happens with many permanently intrusive rules that they began as temporary measures.

De-Legro

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #27 on: February 19, 2014, 11:04:49 PM »
Too much chat for too little reason. Yes we aren't supposed to expand massively in the Guided Start, I don't see a few players expanding more then others as a problem. Preempting "problems" like this often generates more problems then it solves. Two players is not a reliable trend to cause concern.


That said at the end of the day it is irrelevant anyway. Players that want to land grab are going to do so, either now in the guided start or as soon as the guided start and its restrictions end. While I understand the concern about available land for new players, I don't see the issue. Just how many players have the time and inclination to run massive amounts of settlements on their own. That is an important distinction because unless you are going to defend what you have to the level and skill that Bastur and a few others have demonstrated, your land grab is going to do nothing but provide nicely improved settlements for others to take. A few players might indeed have large personal empires but I doubt it will be wide spread. The blobs in the alpha showed just how fragile large empires combined with few players proved to be against dedicated attackers.



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Foxglove

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #28 on: February 19, 2014, 11:07:37 PM »
But let's say everyone did have 16... even though not a single person has yet. Even if everyone wanted fifty lands, so what? Land can be opened up whenever needed. More continents can be made.

That's an important point that I'd forgotten about until just now. The prospect of running out of settlements for players to own, combined with the relatively few activities for players at knight level, was raised repeatedly throughout the testing phases. The answer that was given was that new land would always be able to be added to the map, so running out of settlements for new players to take would never be a problem.
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De-Legro

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Re: Following through on promises
« Reply #29 on: February 19, 2014, 11:10:42 PM »
That's an important point that I'd forgotten about until just now. The prospect of running out of settlements for players to own, combined with the relatively few activities for players at knight level, was raised repeatedly throughout the testing phases. The answer that was given was that new land would always be able to be added to the map, so running out of settlements for new players to take would never be a problem.


Also recall that in the alpha we had basically unlimited characters to play with. Now you are limited to your accounts maximum. Since most people like to keep the Lord sitting in the region to baby sit it that provides a soft sort of limit to the amount of land many players will take.
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